First Build questions

Discussion in 'The Builders Workshop' started by Old Dog, Feb 5, 2019.

  1. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    So, I've picked up some PDP maple shells. Originally they were an '09 M5 kit. I have the bass, floor and a tom.

    I will be doing some filling, some re-drilling, wrapping. In fact, I plan to have a virgin bass and tom. But my main question has to do with the lugs. Is there any detriment in switching from a lug that has TWO mounting screws, to a lug that has only ONE??

    I contacted PDP and the response was basically, "DW/PDP PURPOSELY made some hardware measurements WEIRD, in order to keep people from swapping gear from other manufacturers, in and out". . .
    So I decided to stop trying to actually find matching lugs.

    If the drilled holes are 1 3/8" apart for the lugs, IF I were to TRY a 1 1/2" lug (a single mm of difference), what problems would I run into. Will it make a difference?

    I will close by saying, I've NEVER built anything as far as drums are concerned. I'm a complete NEWB to refurb and building, so try not to destroy me. THANKS!!

    -Chet
     
  2. Pimp-a-diddle

    Pimp-a-diddle Very well Known Member

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    I will be the first to admit that my experience with actual drum construction is very limited and based primarily in theory and research. That said, if you have only a difference of 1/8" between existing top/bottom holes, that doesn't seem like enough space to successfully fill one hole and then re-drill for a new mounting hole at 1 1/2"o/c. And remember, when you tension the drum, that bottom portion of the lug is being pulled upward as the top portion pulls inward( more or less ).
    You could keep the existing bottom hole as-is, and then perhaps notch the top hole an additional 1/16" or so until your mounting holes fit. Or maybe just split the difference top and bottom.
     
  3. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    O
    Well actually, what I had envisioned was to not do what your describing. I also thought re-drilling with such little space would lead to problems. So, I had mentioned switching to a lug with only one mounting screw. I was considering using the lower pre-existing holes, and filling the upper pre-existing holes. Or, I was going to fill both, and re-drill in a completely different spot.

    And the notching!! That's another choice I saw in my head. I wasn't sure how safe that was.

    A single mounting screw for lugs, when it previously had 2. . .makes me think I should stick with 2 somehow.
     
  4. Pimp-a-diddle

    Pimp-a-diddle Very well Known Member

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    Ahhh, okay. Just make sure you get really well machined lugs and not some "Maxwin"-style garbage. There's a LOT of cheap hardware floating around out there these days. If I were switching to a single point lug, I'd definitely pay the little bit of extra cash and get the Trick brand. Everything that guy makes is solid as a rock.
     
  5. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the heads up on Trick. I've been doing search after search on Drum Factory Direct. I hear good things about them. . .I didn't want the cheapest, but budgeted.
     
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  6. davezedlee

    davezedlee DFO Veteran

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    single-point lugs cause the shells to dent inwards
    Washer Indents.JPG
     
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  7. GeeDeeEmm

    GeeDeeEmm Well-Known Member

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    I'm assuming that you want to switch lugs because you don't like the Pacific oval lugs?

    Well, notching one of the holes only 1/16" is not going to hurt anything at all. I'm with Pimp-a-Diddle - I would notch the top hole just a bit to make the new lugs line up properly. Then, use slightly larger washers inside the shell on the tension casing (lug) screws. These simple steps will fix you up just fine, and will allow you to avoid filling holes, redrilling, and all that nonsense.

    The Pacific M5 sets have good maple shells, so you are starting with very sound drums. Swapping out the lugs for nicer-looking models will make the drums look much better. (I have a CX kit which I LOVE, but I've disliked the oval lugs from day one.)

    Keep us updated on your progress. Sounds like a fun and interesting project.

    GeeDeeEmm

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    Mr. Moore good to hear from you. I posted this stuff over at D-World, didn't get any response.

    THE SHELLS ARE BARE! Except for wrap. Literally nothing. Which is why I have so many unansered ?s. This was a hard place to start, but it's going to be original, I hope. I am definitely leaning towards the notching work.

    I was VERY CURIOUS about a single mount screw--and what would happen. THANKS DAVE
     
  9. GeeDeeEmm

    GeeDeeEmm Well-Known Member

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    Dave, are you talking about mounting your new lugs using only one screw? That would be feasible, as long as you use the bottom screw. As was pointed out, the mechanical tension causes the top portion of the casing (the end closest to the drum head) to pull in toward the shell, while the bottom portion of the casing tries to pull away from the shell - though ever so slightly. The real brunt of the force is carried by the lug bosses (the part of the lug that the screws are anchored in), which normally ride just inside the shell.

    If you've followed my muddled explanation, then you understand that the screw and boss that bears the most load is the one at the bottom of the lug. Theoretically, you could safely mount the lugs with that screw/washer only. I wouldn't do that. For one, the unsecured end of the lug might rattle. Might. But the most logical solution would be to install both screws. You will need to open up the upper hole a bit anyway, because the lug boss is going to be inserted into the shell. Why not spend a few pennies on the second screw/washer? You'll sleep better, I promise.

    GeeDeeEmm
     
  10. dawoodude

    dawoodude Well-Known Member

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    You can go either way. Using a drill and bit you can "pull" the bit in each direction to make the spacing open to 1 1/2". FWIW, I carry the die cast Arch2 lug with 1 1/2" spacing as well as the Ghostnote single point. Larger fender washers come with the single points as well as gaskets if you want to check them out.
     
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  11. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    I would definitely like to check them out. I have no idea exactly what I'm doing yet as far as the hardware. And to be honest, when searching on DFDirect, they give so many choices. . .makes me dizzy, lol. Do you have a website or??. . . . .pm if you need. Thanks
     
  12. dawoodude

    dawoodude Well-Known Member

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    sent you a link
     
  13. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the link. I tried to reply but apparently, I need to figure out some settings. I will check things out for sure.
     
  14. JazzDrumGuy

    JazzDrumGuy DFO Master

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    I had a vintage Rogers dynasonic COB shell and parts off a pearl Elite snare. The tube lugs did not fit the Rogers so I slightly drilled out the shell holes and they fit just fine. Very simple to do and although I had to drill holes for the butt plate and throw off, it turned out great.

    Just so you know, DW lugs fit the same hole spacing as the oval PDP lugs so if you want to spend a bunch of money to get DW turret lugs, you can also do that. I think there are also DW tube lugs but they cost an arm and a leg also because nobody except DW makes them in that exact size which I believe is 1 3/8"
     
  15. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    I would like to be mindful about spending. I don't want to put the priciest stuff on. Good quality wanted for sure, but not necessarily a matching brand situation.
     
  16. JazzDrumGuy

    JazzDrumGuy DFO Master

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    I totally get it. The Beavertail (slingy) copies at Drumfactory direct are pretty cheap....one of these days, I will go that route. I suggest just drilling out the old holes or simply using one of them and drilling a new hole for the 2nd hole......

    They also have a clearance tab at the top left and have clearance lugs listed all the time....
     
  17. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    I'm almost positive I have the beavertails saved to my wish list there. I did NOT see the clearance tab! I'm about 98% sure I'm going to simply notch the hole closer to the center of the drum--and use the existing lower drilled hole. I don't want swiss cheese shells.
     
  18. Tommy D

    Tommy D Very well Known Member

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    Any 1 1/2" hole spacing lug will fit with some coercing of a round file. It will take some work, but the holes will be completely covered by the lugs and the washers.
     
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  19. JazzDrumGuy

    JazzDrumGuy DFO Master

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    Top left tab, under "Deals" (not clearance, my bad) - then go to lugs.......
     
  20. Old Dog

    Old Dog Well-Known Member

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    Hey no worries, I found them, lol. Yeah, I'm definitely going to stick in the $5 or under range when it comes to lugs. I found some used bass drum tension rods with claws on ebay. Haven't bought them yet, but I may.

    Tommy D!! Thank you for that. That sounds much safer than breakin' out the drill! I already found my little roundish file. Awesome man, thanks
     

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