Overtones vs. Thud!

Discussion in 'General' started by Swole2112, Jan 5, 2019.

  1. Swole2112

    Swole2112 Active Member

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    The more research I do, the more I think the only way to remove overtones in a tom is to use moongel, dampening rings, masking tape, etc. and effectively kill sustain. Is that about right? Is there no other way?
     
  2. Pimp-a-diddle

    Pimp-a-diddle Very well Known Member

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    Different heads. If you want a flatter sound, go with Emperors or Pinstripes, or their Evans/Aquarian equivalent. What type of shells do you have?
     
  3. JDA

    JDA DFO Master

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    Yes you tune it down, maybe a thicker clear head on top (or somewhere) just watch the rods don't fall out.
    (or maybe literally take half out ..)
    All the other -stuff- will cut whatever volume you began with.
    Or you could also be the first in 2019 to experiment removing the bottom heads.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
  4. EvEnStEvEn

    EvEnStEvEn ~Lounge Lizard~

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    Drum companies used to install internal tone controls for this very thing and you can still buy external tone control devices that adjust the level of muffling desired.
     
  5. Balance

    Balance Well-Known Member

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    Check the bearing edges, they should sit flat. Check for out of roundness. If you play in a small room, take it from me, you will get lots of bad overtones unless you use wall dampening. So much to talk about but it's an important subject. Dampening should be the last resort to bad overtones, unless that's the specific sound you want.
     
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  6. Mongrel

    Mongrel Very well Known Member

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    All I can add to the good advice already given would be to record your drums on a decent set up-even a hand held zoom would work.

    I discovered that microphones are way less picky than my ears when it comes to overtones and realized I had been trying to achieve a level of tuning based on recordings that was impossible to get "live" without killing the sound.

    In other words-let the to s sing out and don't try and control every little "overtone"-even if they don't sound perfect to your ears. The audience and the mics won't hear it anyway.
     
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  7. mfryed2112

    mfryed2112 DFO Master

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    Try some pinstripes, if you want even less use a coated pinstripe
     
  8. MrDrums2112

    MrDrums2112 "Normal" Drummer

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    Heads and tuning are the keys. If you play with a band, those overtones will quickly be buried in the mix. There are good overtones and bad. Find that pleasing overtone through the tuning. All drums will have that sweet spot where it just sings and resonates. Tuning takes patience and practice. Don’t be afraid to experiment and eventually you may find that you don’t need much muffling at all on the drums. Bob Gatzen’s tuning vids (YouTube) are also very good.
     
  9. SteveB

    SteveB DFO Master

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    I did a session once where I smacked a fairly loose floor tom out in the open, so the drum was totally exposed. It was meant to be a musical period of sorts after a thick horn section. What the engineer did was go into Protools and trim (truncate) the ending, then cross fade it so that it was abrupt with no lasting tone. You'd have a very hard time getting a tom to shut down like that by only looking at the head and muffling choice. In this case the batter was already muffled some already and the bottom was both mic'd and wide open for a decent duration during normal playing.

    Although I've never done it, a few cotton balls placed in the bottom of the drum can help shorten the note. I personally never use muffled or thick heads because i want options on the other end. Instead I use tape and small pads, etc.
     
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  10. Swole2112

    Swole2112 Active Member

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    Sound Percussion Labs. Now, before you rush to conclusions, let me say I have the street bop kit which I believe SPL put a higher level of construction quality to as it was meant to compete with the Ludwig breakbeats kit.
     
  11. mfryed2112

    mfryed2112 DFO Master

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    Also, hook up with other drummers and get there perspective, let them play while you listen to your own drums.
     
  12. Ray Dee Oh King

    Ray Dee Oh King Very well Known Member

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    Of recent I put some Aquarian Focus X w/ power dot heads on all my toms for batters and they sound fabulous! Just the right amount of sustain and a nice thick, clear note. I havent tried to tension them up high yet. I've been pretty pleased at the lower tunings, but I'm sure they still sound great up high!
     
  13. icetech

    icetech Very well Known Member

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    Match your lugs... get them all at the same pitch and the overtones just disappear.. at least for me, was the most important thing i learned in tuning.

    P.S. i used to want to get rid of any ringing at all.. now i actually tune some in, drums sound dead to me without it.
     
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  14. CherryClassic

    CherryClassic DFO Veteran

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    I'd go along with that!! Even tuning is always the best. With my ears the Tune Bot is the only way I can it that way. I like my drums to sing to the max but yet die out with an even tone. However in some venues I will use some type of damping to control duration if necessary.

    sherm
     
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  15. Obiwandrumobe

    Obiwandrumobe Very well Known Member

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    ------------------------------------------
    Ebay
     
  16. Tornado

    Tornado Very well Known Member

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    The construction is probably fine, but are you using the stock heads? I'm assuming they didn't come with quality heads from the factory at the price point those are offered at.
     
  17. Rick

    Rick Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. Even pitches seems to be a major factor in getting rid of unwanted overtones. I don’t think you have to use the Tunebot if you have good enough ears to hear minor pitch differences. But if you want to get it as perfect as possible (I’m OCD that way), then the Tunebot can help you do that. I use it and get great results. My toms sing with a nice pure tone. The only dampening I use is half a piece of moongel on the floor tom (and depending on the venue, on my snare too). And with the Tunebot, I have the lug pitch frequency saved for each drum and get it right back to the same exact tuning after a few gigs and/or after changing a head. It’s a great tool in my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
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  18. Rick

    Rick Well-Known Member

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    Just in case this is helpful to anybody, here are the Tunebot lug pitch frequencies I use on my drums. First, I’ll give the type of drums and heads, because obviously that would make a difference...

    Snare is a 14X6 Tama Starphonic Bubinga. Everything else is Tama Starclassic Maple... 22X18, 10X8, 12X9, and 16X14. Snare has Aquarian Texture coated for the batter and Aquarian Classic Clear Snare Side for the reso. Bass drum has clear REMO Powerstroke 3 for the batter and ebony Powerstroke 3 with mic port for the reso. Toms are all clear Attack Terry Bozzio heads batter and reso.

    So here are the lug pitches and resulting fundamental pitch by drum:

    Snare - 290hz batter, 397hz snare side. G#
    10” Tom - 262hz batter and reso. Eb
    12” Tom - 198hz batter and reso. Bb
    16” Tom - 149hz batter and reso. between E# and F
    Bass Drum - 52hz batter, 56hz reso. C to C#
     
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  19. Swole2112

    Swole2112 Active Member

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    No, I never did. I put Evans G1s on them straight away.
     
  20. Swole2112

    Swole2112 Active Member

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    I actually just got a Drum Dial as an early birthday gift and used it for the first time today. Been a bit under the weather so only tuned the rack tom before stopping. I've got a few questions about it but I think I'll start a new thread for it since I think everybody's pretty much finished with this one.
     

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