Low pitch or dark sounding Zildjian A ride or crash?

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Jazzhead

Jazzhead

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I am not talking about vintage Zildjians because possibly you can find these in 40’s and 50’s, I am talking maybe post 80’s to date.

Anyone come across Zildjian A model ride or crash that is more dark sounding or low pitch?

So, basically an A that sounds more like a K. If so, which size and model was it?
 
You taking an A that sounds like a modern day K? Closest might be Armand series or the CIE series, both discontinued. Or perhaps the discontinued A Avedis with the artificial pantina.
 
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SonorBart said:
A Zildjian Deep Rides are darker than typical A's. I remember them in the late 70's/early 80's and again for awhile in the 90's.
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Yes this would be my suggestion as well. The first Deep Rides were early Ks, really. Flat profile, lots of hammering with larger strikes, and on the heavier side. They had a fat, low, penetrating ping, and took a lot to make them open up, due largely to the weight and cup size, which was not large. Re-introduced in the early 90s, I believe in 20" only. Different lathing and hammering, but still low profile and a lower frequency range. Not a bad cymbal, especially for a heavy player.
 
Jazzhead said:
I didn’t know about them, so Zildjian makes these trans stamp copy cymbals only for MDS?
Oh I guess it’s like the Morello and PJJ rides.
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I would audition the A Avedis Dark Ride carefully before purchasing. I bought one a few years ago and although it turned out to sound very much like it did in the MDS video (it was considerably higher-pitched and more "A"-sounding than a modern 22" K Ride, one of which I own and was able to play side-by-side with the A Avedis Dark), the bow made it extremely stiff under my stick — so stiff in fact that it felt like I was playing on a block of cement, with practically no 'give' at all. After a few months I traded it in at Pro Drum Shop. Although "Dark" is part of the cymbal's name I found it to be a lot less dark sounding than a standard 22" A Avedis Ride cymbal (one of which I own) and not at all in the same ballpark as a modern 22" K Ride.
 
hsosdrum said:
I would audition the A Avedis Dark Ride carefully before purchasing. I bought one a few years ago and although it turned out to sound very much like it did in the MDS video (it was considerably higher-pitched and more "A"-sounding than a modern 22" K Ride, one of which I own and was able to play side-by-side with the A Avedis Dark), the bow made it extremely stiff under my stick — so stiff in fact that it felt like I was playing on a block of cement, with practically no 'give' at all. After a few months I traded it in at Pro Drum Shop. Although "Dark" is part of the cymbal's name I found it to be a lot less dark sounding than a standard 22" A Avedis Ride cymbal (one of which I own) and not at all in the same ballpark as a modern 22" K Ride.
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By “standard 22” Avedis A ride” which line do you mean? do you mean the discontinued 22” avedis line (small avedis signature logo)? Or the traditional 22” A medium ride?
 
hsosdrum said:
I would audition the A Avedis Dark Ride carefully before purchasing. I bought one a few years ago and although it turned out to sound very much like it did in the MDS video (it was considerably higher-pitched and more "A"-sounding than a modern 22" K Ride, one of which I own and was able to play side-by-side with the A Avedis Dark), the bow made it extremely stiff under my stick — so stiff in fact that it felt like I was playing on a block of cement, with practically no 'give' at all. After a few months I traded it in at Pro Drum Shop. Although "Dark" is part of the cymbal's name I found it to be a lot less dark sounding than a standard 22" A Avedis Ride cymbal (one of which I own) and not at all in the same ballpark as a modern 22" K Ride.
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Yes! Especially the 80s Deep Rides. Extremely hammered. Very much inline with the older K Heavy ride. At least the 20" I had. Great cymbal if you want definition, and a dark, low pitch. Would work well for fusion for sure.
 
BrentonVintage said:
Yes! Especially the 80s Deep Rides. Extremely hammered. Very much inline with the older K Heavy ride. At least the 20" I had. Great cymbal if you want definition, and a dark, low pitch. Would work well for fusion for sure.
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Sounds like a perfect cymbal, right? They can be very heavy and loud though. It's as if someone played a Rock ride and wanted it to be lower in pitch.
 
Other than a Deep Ride or possibly an Avedis , I don't think a "post 1980 original A. Zildjian that's lower pitched or darker than a K" exists. If it does, it's a complete fluke and the K was made way out of spec (too heavy) and somehow made it past quality control into the wild. It's not impossible for that to happen, but it would be a mistake.

I guess the question is: which K are you referring to? An original K from Istanbul? Or a modern K? If it's a modern K, there's a better chance of finding an A that sounds similar in pitch and sound, because many modern Ks sound like what older As (from the 60s/70s) sound like.

I've said this before, but many cymbal models and lines are chasing the original A Zildjian sound, or some variation of it.
 
Seb77 said:
Sounds like a perfect cymbal, right? They can be very heavy and loud though. It's as if someone played a Rock ride and wanted it to be lower in pitch.
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Well perfect is subjective. I moved on from mine, but I do wish I still had it, just to have in the arsenal.
 
John DeChristopher said:
Other than a Deep Ride or possibly an Avedis , I don't think a "post 1980 original A. Zildjian that's lower pitched or darker than a K" exists. If it does, it's a complete fluke and the K was made way out of spec (too heavy) and somehow made it past quality control into the wild. It's not impossible for that to happen, but it would be a mistake.

I guess the question is: which K are you referring to? An original K from Istanbul? Or a modern K? If it's a modern K, there's a better chance of finding an A that sounds similar in pitch and sound, because many modern Ks sound like what older As (from the 60s/70s) sound like.

I've said this before, but many cymbal models and lines are chasing the original A Zildjian sound, or some variation of it.
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I was referring to modern Ks mostly, maybe from last 20-30 years.
Vintage 60’s 70’s A Zildjians are mostly bright though, a dark one and low pitch from that era would be a special one. In my experience 40’s and 50’s Zildjians tend to be darker.
 
Jazzhead said:
By “standard 22” Avedis A ride” which line do you mean? do you mean the discontinued 22” avedis line (small avedis signature logo)? Or the traditional 22” A medium ride?
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The discontinued Avedis line. I have a 22" and it's definitely darker sounding than the 22" A Avedis Dark from MDS that I used to own.
 
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